Want to help bipolar-2 friend move to better home

[London-Ontario]

Hello,

I have a female friend (42yrs old; diagnosed 28yrs old) who is bp, bpd, ocd and others, who chooses not to take medications, because of side-effects and I support her decision, even though she is very agitated throughout the day, everyday, week after week spending most of her time alone, mostly taking long walks to deal with her inner-thoughts. I might only be able to talk to her for a combined 10 minutes on a good day, but I have talked to her enough now to know what her plans are for the future. She would like to move to a different place where she does not have to deal with so many people and she knows she cannot move to a new location without assistance. It's clear someone will need to do all the foot work for her to organize the move, but what about bills and meals? She does not like assisted living arrangements, because of the stigma of living in a place like that, but what other options are there out there for people with bp? At the moment, she lives in a homeless shelter (unfortunately bp took her down to the shelter), which has a very hostile and unfriendly living environment and is interfering with her remaining calm. If she could remain calm, then she could focus on her health.

Would someone have some tips on decreasing her agitation (she's all wound up) and/or tips on bipolar friendly living accommodations? She has told me in the past that an apartment on its own (perhaps above a variety store or at the back of a house) would be an ideal location, because she knows she can be loud sometimes when she talks back to her inner-thoughts. I have seen her argue with her inner-thoughts. She wouldn’t want the neighbours knocking on her door to ask if anything is wrong.

She had best results with the medications Epival and Effexor, but quit taking them, because of the increased toxic levels. Her healthcare team would like her to take Zeprexa, but Zeprexa is to strong for her system.

Regards,
Dan

[paul m]

Hello Dan. First lets make a couple of things clear. You are a great guy for wanting to help this person. Two This person would have a tough time getting better if she was on medications and three, because she self medicates on cannabis she has almost zero chance of getting better as long as she self medicates that way.

You have mentioned several times now about the "Toxic" level of meds she was taking and I am unsure what you mean. There are hundreds of different combos of meds she could try and one of them will work if she gives up the cannabis.

How does one live on your own. I don't know exactly what all London offers, but I do know that if a doc is willing to certifiy that she is unable to work she can collect about $1000 a mth on ODSP. If she hasn't already she should get a CSW(community support worker) from CMHA on Huron St (I think that's where it is) and have them explain what is available for aid and moving expenses. I think(the CSW would know) that someone who moves from a group setting to a single apt is entitiled to about $800 to pay for things like phone and hydro hook up, rent deposit etc. . I am not sure of how often a person can claim this, but the CSW would know.

Also in London there are foods banks and on Dundas St somewhere just east of Elizabeth is a low cost food mission that serves hot meals. I I think it is run by St Joesph Hospitality center. For $25 a mth you you are entitiled to have a breakfast and a lunch every day. That's less than 50 cents a meal. Take Care. paul m

[London-Ontario]

Suggestions to help bp-2 friend increase quality of her life

Hello Paul,

Thank you for replying. I need some bp insight for guidance and direction.

Yes, I feel she is at a turning point with self medicating on cannabis. It appears she knows that she cannot go years living life in the "fog". She relies on it to help turn off her inner-thoughts of sorts. I've learned to stay away from her when she's "high", because she is to unpredictable.

In the past she mentioned that her health care team took her off of Epival and Effexor, because her hep-c / liver problem helped increased some sort of toxic level in her blood / platelets. There's a thyroid problem too.

My friend has several disorders; bp, ocd, bpd, panic, learning, short-term memory, hep-c, anxiety, self-harm, head injury / accident as a child, thyroid, tremors, father had bp. She was diagnosed at 28 yrs. Having a daughter took a lot out of her from what I understand.

I have just learned that Community Living London has 5 assisted living houses specific to residents who suffer from bipolar, but the question is will she make the move when I ask her in the next few days? I'd like to propose a long-term plan / strategy to her; one that would start with moving to assisted living with the gradual decrease of cannabis and then the introduction of (new) med combos along with psychotherapy. I have a brother who lives with Homes for Special Care and who is employed with Community Living London. I visit him regularly and would be there weekly to help my friend settle in her new place. That's my plan, but how do I present it to her when she spends most of her time walking alone self-absorbed in agitation, which includes some laughter, but mostly negative self-replies to what she's thinking about. She thinks out loud. Most of her thoughts are to due with the separation from her 18 year old daughter. In the last few days, my friend has scratched her entire face and arms (self-harm), likely due to the thought of paying $500 to the shelter for rent. They were after her for paying the rent late. After paying the rent, leaves her with $400 in her pocket for coffee, restaurant food and cannabis. If she was living in the other shelter down the road where "women's crash beds" are located she would not be expected to pay rent at all, therefore, she would have all $900 in her pocket for coffee, food and cannabis. The women's shelter would require her to leave every day at 7am and let her back in the evening at 9pm. She's lived in women's crash beds before leaving at 7am to walk about (mostly by herself downtown London)in her bipolar maze until 9pm at night. I'm starting to wonder if she is not considering moving back to women's crash beds because of the extra pocket money to put towards cannabis (?).

[paul m]

Hello Dan. I assuming that she is collecting ODSP or some of provincial support. Ontario divides it's ODSP payments into two parts(one ck, but based on two parts). A shelter allowance (Maximum roughly $450.00) and a Maximum living allowance(Roughly 550 per mth). If you do not pay rent or pay less than $450 when they find out they just cut your ck back to whatever your rent is and $550 per mth. So by not paying rent she is still only going to collect $550 per mth(max). There are a few small ways that a person might increase this by $50 or so, but not many. Living in a shelter would leave her less money as she would receive no shelter allowance and have to buy all of her food in restaurants. Plus ODSP sometimes doesn't make it easy for the homeless to collect.

In regards to "will she accept your proposal to help her?" I cannot answer that one, I can't even make an educated guess. Unfortunately people with bipolar sometimes refuse reasonable offers of help. The very nature of the illness means that some of us are not rational at times or rather we think that we are entirely rational and it's the rest of the world that is screwed up. All, that you can do is present it to her and see what she sez.

In regards to medication. Having Hep C would complicate things, but there are still meds that would work without over taxing her liver. A lot of meds have separate prescribing info for people with liver problems. But the basic choice comes down to, do I want to live like I am or do I want to find what may work.

Psychotherapy is definitely a good way to go, providing the person is somewhat stable and willing to partake.

If she is collecting ODSP then she must have a support worker. If you are worried about her self harm you can try talking to them about it, but their solution will likely be hospitalization at best. Some workers are good, some not so great.

Others who may be able to help her or you, are narcotics anonymous, like A.A. but for people with drug problems and possible various members of London's Mental Health Alliance. The members are listed here . http://www.londonmentalhealthalliance.ca/agencies.asp

I am sorry that I have not been of more help. Your friend faces a difficult challenge to get better, but not impossible. If you have more questions, I will try to answer them as well as I can. Take Care. paul m

[London-Ontario]

You replying to my post gives me strength to continue thinking of ways to approach my friend with suggestions for change. I've also been taking a lot of encouragement from bp author Julie Fast who herself has bp and who has wrote a few books (Take Charge of BP) on bp as well as posted over what looks like 500 youtube videos on bp. The videos are great quality!

So to take advice from Julie Fast including youself, I think I need to be a little more firm with my friend and not appear to side with her on some measures she takes to deal with her symptoms. I need to stand up more and be firm that I don't agree with the coninuous use of cannabis amongst a few other issues. I need to let her know she is about 70% on-track and that she needs help to deal with the other 30%. Meaning she needs try as hard as she can to take charge of her bp! I'm just going to be a stronger supportive friend for the benefit of my friend.


I'm so greatful to meet you and I'll keep you posted with what she says to my proposal. I'll send you an email in the next few weeks. I think deep down inside she's ready for a change. She's tierd of it.

Talk to you soon.

[paul m]

Hello Dan. I certainly wish you well in your efforts to help your friend. Helping someone with bipolar can be really difficult. The Mood Disorders of Ontario has a really good fact sheet about helping someone with a mood disorder. Once again, good luck with your efforts and Take Care. paul m

http://www.mooddisorders.on.ca/helping.html

[Atlantis]

Hi Dan,
I have been reading this thread but was unsure how to respond, Paul was doing such a great job that I stayed quiet, I do tend to put my foot in my mouth from time to time

I just wanted to say that I wish we all had someone as caring as you in our lives.

[uni]

Hello Dan. I'll chime in with Atlantis in saying that I wish we all had someone as caring as you in our lives. Whether or not your friend will go along with your suggestions, you will have put them out there and maybe planted some seeds, which can make a positive difference.

You mention Julie Fast. I have her book "Getting it done while you're depressed" and have found it helpful because it is so simple and manageable to read. I also watched a couple of her videos a while back, so understand why you find them helpful.

Other than that, all I have to say is, please remember to look after Dan in all this, too. I wish you and your friend all the best.

[paul m]

Hello Karen. Thx, but you and the rest here do a pretty great job of providing support. So just because I seem to be doing ok, never be shy about adding your words. They are every bit as valuable as mine, sometimes more so. Take Care. paul m

[Atlantis]

Thanks Paul